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Read books, don't burn them

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Read books, don't burn them
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Blog of ReasonHelperUser avatarPosts: 240Joined: Fri Apr 10, 2009 2:28 pmLocation: League of Reason

Post Read books, don't burn them

Discussion thread for the blog entry "Read books, don't burn them" by rabbitpirate.

Permalink: http://blog.theleagueofreason.co.uk/reason/read-books-dont-burn-them/
Fri Sep 10, 2010 12:41 pm
Nashy19Posts: 250Joined: Sun May 10, 2009 5:37 pm

Post Re: Read books, don't burn them

I don't care if somebody burns a popular book (some people are acting like all books contain rare non-recoverable knowledge), so I don't want to do anything in response to it. I'll read whenever I feel like reading, there's nothing magically about doing it on the same day :P
Fri Sep 10, 2010 1:28 pm
lrkunUser avatarPosts: 3831Joined: Wed Jun 23, 2010 8:37 pmLocation: R. Gender: Tree

Post Re: Read books, don't burn them

I read, therefore I am.

I dislike burning books, because it is not practical. Therefore, I do not support such.

I read everyday, because I love reading books. Therefore, like any day, I'll be reading on September 11, 2010 too.
Unsupport unthink.
Fri Sep 10, 2010 1:46 pm
Aught3ModeratorUser avatarPosts: 4290Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2009 3:36 amLocation: New Zealand Gender: Male

Post Re: Read books, don't burn them

Huh! My group has more members than theirs...just :lol:
Wanderer, there is no path, the path is made by walking.
Fri Sep 10, 2010 2:19 pm
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JosanUser avatarPosts: 426Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2009 10:56 pm

Post Re: Read books, don't burn them

Nashy19 wrote:I don't care if somebody burns a popular book (some people are acting like all books contain rare non-recoverable knowledge), so I don't want to do anything in response to it. I'll read whenever I feel like reading, there's nothing magically about doing it on the same day


Ever heard of a symbolic gesture?

There's nothing magical about reading a book the same day someone intends to burn the same book, but it sends a clear message that some people still think a civilized society shouldn't stand for censorship.
Image
Fri Sep 10, 2010 3:19 pm
Nashy19Posts: 250Joined: Sun May 10, 2009 5:37 pm

Post Re: Read books, don't burn them

Josan wrote:
Nashy19 wrote:I don't care if somebody burns a popular book (some people are acting like all books contain rare non-recoverable knowledge), so I don't want to do anything in response to it. I'll read whenever I feel like reading, there's nothing magically about doing it on the same day


Ever heard of a symbolic gesture?

There's nothing magical about reading a book the same day someone intends to burn the same book, but it sends a clear message that some people still think a civilized society shouldn't stand for censorship.


Just because book burning is a very old form of censorship doesn't mean this is censorship, and it's not by the definitions I have, not that if something is defined as censorship it is automatically bad. What if, in the future, a small group of people decided to delete one their eBooks? :|
Fri Sep 10, 2010 3:39 pm
lrkunUser avatarPosts: 3831Joined: Wed Jun 23, 2010 8:37 pmLocation: R. Gender: Tree

Post Re: Read books, don't burn them

Nashy19 wrote:Just because book burning is a very old form of censorship doesn't mean this is censorship, and it's not by the definitions I have, not that if something is defined as censorship it is automatically bad. What if, in the future, a group of people decided to delete one their eBooks? :|


What is censorship?

The article says somethings about censorhip. Maybe, understanding what it is, what causes it, how it is done, and what is its effect will provide revelation with respect as to why burning books is considered censorship.
Unsupport unthink.
Fri Sep 10, 2010 3:51 pm
GiliellUser avatarPosts: 1218Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 7:29 am Gender: Female

Post Re: Read books, don't burn them

I hope you don't mind if it's Harry Potter
But on the other hand, that is a symbol against censorship, too
Witches for the win!
Go to heaven, we don't want you in hell with us!
Most people don't object to discrimination and oppression as such, they only object to being at the receiving end
Fri Sep 10, 2010 4:57 pm
rabbitpirateLeague LegendUser avatarPosts: 101Joined: Thu Jul 23, 2009 11:29 pm

Post Re: Read books, don't burn them

Giliell wrote:I hope you don't mind if it's Harry Potter
But on the other hand, that is a symbol against censorship, too
Witches for the win!


Not at all. I just this moment got my copy of Nonsense on Stilts by Massimo Pigliucci arrive in the mail so I'll probably be reading that.
Thetis: What if courage and imagination became everyday mortal qualities? What will become of us?
Zeus: We would no longer be needed. But, for the moment, there is sufficient cowardice, sloth and mendacity down there on Earth to last forever.
Sat Sep 11, 2010 11:03 am
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Aught3ModeratorUser avatarPosts: 4290Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2009 3:36 amLocation: New Zealand Gender: Male

Post Re: Read books, don't burn them

Well I've made it through Sura 4 (Women) so far. Rather interesting, starts off with the rules about inheritance, who you can marry, what happens to a deceased's wife, and so on. Then jumps into a long section about attacking unbelievers with Jews getting a special mention. Then the last verse goes back to the rules about inheritance. Lots of praising Allah through-out.
Wanderer, there is no path, the path is made by walking.
Sat Sep 11, 2010 11:20 am
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CybridPosts: 2Joined: Sun Sep 12, 2010 11:00 pm Gender: Male

Post Re: Read books, don't burn them

Well, first of all, hello all, this is my first post. Now, going straight to the point, I have to say that even though ovbiously burning books is a quite stupid thing to do for many reasons, I don't think I need to mention them. I can't help but think that building a mosque 2 blocks away from ground zero is clearly looking for provocation and unrest; If the promoters of the idea thought that it would not spur on any actions against it, they were either naive to the point of idiocy or just plain stupid. In my humble opinion both acts should be stopped.
Sun Sep 12, 2010 11:12 pm
rabbitpirateLeague LegendUser avatarPosts: 101Joined: Thu Jul 23, 2009 11:29 pm

Post Re: Read books, don't burn them

Cybrid wrote:Well, first of all, hello all, this is my first post. Now, going straight to the point, I have to say that even though ovbiously burning books is a quite stupid thing to do for many reasons, I don't think I need to mention them. I can't help but think that building a mosque 2 blocks away from ground zero is clearly looking for provocation and unrest; If the promoters of the idea thought that it would not spur on any actions against it, they were either naive to the point of idiocy or just plain stupid. In my humble opinion both acts should be stopped.


Except it is not a mosque. It is a community centre with a prayer room. In fact it will apparently have three prayer rooms. One for Muslims, one for Christians and one for Jews. Plus of course a basket ball court. So if that makes it a mosque then it is also a church, a synagogue and a sports arena.
Thetis: What if courage and imagination became everyday mortal qualities? What will become of us?
Zeus: We would no longer be needed. But, for the moment, there is sufficient cowardice, sloth and mendacity down there on Earth to last forever.
Mon Sep 13, 2010 6:02 pm
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CybridPosts: 2Joined: Sun Sep 12, 2010 11:00 pm Gender: Male

Post Re: Read books, don't burn them

rabbitpirate wrote:
Cybrid wrote:Well, first of all, hello all, this is my first post. Now, going straight to the point, I have to say that even though ovbiously burning books is a quite stupid thing to do for many reasons, I don't think I need to mention them. I can't help but think that building a mosque 2 blocks away from ground zero is clearly looking for provocation and unrest; If the promoters of the idea thought that it would not spur on any actions against it, they were either naive to the point of idiocy or just plain stupid. In my humble opinion both acts should be stopped.


Except it is not a mosque. It is a community centre with a prayer room. In fact it will apparently have three prayer rooms. One for Muslims, one for Christians and one for Jews. Plus of course a basket ball court. So if that makes it a mosque then it is also a church, a synagogue and a sports arena.


Oops, ok, note taken, the information I had was either incomplete, innacurate or both, I should have tried to inform myself better.
Mon Sep 13, 2010 10:45 pm
MorituriMaxPosts: 6Joined: Fri Oct 08, 2010 6:20 am Gender: Male

Post Re: Read books, don't burn them

I think they should burn a few Qurans. If for no other reason than to show people that we will not quake in fear from the threats of radical Islamists.

I think we would see the same militant behavior from any religion which has its hooks deep into the Government and is allowed to shape the laws of the country in which the powerful religion is based. Most countries with strong Muslim ties in their governments seem to inevitably adopt Shariah Law as well as the treatment of its women which this entails.

If the USA had the same kind of saturation and control by the Christian Religion in its government, I have no doubt that we would see the same kind of stone age laws controlling the country which was present in Persia and which locked that country in the dark ages throughout the centuries to present time. We probably would have had several Religious Crusades between the East and West as well.

So I say burn a few Holy Books to show that we are not afraid of the militants, instead of bowing down to political correctness which is paralyzing us all. If I wanted to censor the Quran, I would call for ALL of them to be burned. I just want a few hundred of them burned. And a few hundred Bibles, and whatever other books are held up over our heads as to how we should live our lives. I wonder if that Preacher would consider burning Bibles side by side with the Qurans?
Fri Oct 08, 2010 6:30 am
MorituriMaxPosts: 6Joined: Fri Oct 08, 2010 6:20 am Gender: Male

Post Re: Read books, don't burn them

rabbitpirate wrote:
Cybrid wrote:Well, first of all, hello all, this is my first post. Now, going straight to the point, I have to say that even though ovbiously burning books is a quite stupid thing to do for many reasons, I don't think I need to mention them. I can't help but think that building a mosque 2 blocks away from ground zero is clearly looking for provocation and unrest; If the promoters of the idea thought that it would not spur on any actions against it, they were either naive to the point of idiocy or just plain stupid. In my humble opinion both acts should be stopped.


Except it is not a mosque. It is a community centre with a prayer room. In fact it will apparently have three prayer rooms. One for Muslims, one for Christians and one for Jews. Plus of course a basket ball court. So if that makes it a mosque then it is also a church, a synagogue and a sports arena.


Just out of curiosity, out of the people praying there, how many are muslims, how many are christians, and how many are jews?

I also wonder why you say "of course" it has a basketball court? Is that a legal requirement for community centers which are also places of prayer? :?

Down here in the deep south (Alabama) we have plenty of Churches, but the reality in most of them is that if white people attend regularly, they make it very.... uncomfortable for black people to attend, even though they publically claim to embrace them. The same goes for black churches, it's not a very comfortable experience for white people to show up. A fact of life which never gets much light shined on it. It's just the "way it is." Another reason I don't embrace Jesus as my Lord and Master.
Fri Oct 08, 2010 6:39 am
CasewithSciencePosts: 5Joined: Sun Jun 13, 2010 7:06 pm Gender: Pinecone

Post Re: Read books, don't burn them

Hello,

My name is Alex Stewart and I did, publicly, burn a koran and a bible in Australia.

I think a lot of the "read a book instead of burning one" stuff in this thread is nonsense.

Burning a book in the modern age does not carry the negative connotations that it did during the era before the printing press. Burning a bible or koran today (when there are millions of copies of both) is not in the same league as burning Aristotle's Categories.

Accordingly, the act of burning a holy book can only be seen as symbolic.

Some people may use that symbol for hatred as I think Rev Jones did.

My own symbolic burning of holy books was wholly different. I saw the US President kowtow to pressure from some groups in society and pressure an individual to give up his civil right to free expression. To me, even though I would have joined the chorus calling Terry Jones a fool for burning the koran, the executive's interference in free expression of a citizen was intolerable. In doing so, I held deeply to a quote from Benjamin Franklin:

"They who give up essential liberty for a little, temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor security"

The freedom of expression is such an essential liberty and though I did not agree with burning holy books (and have later apologised to those that felt suffering) as a symbolic gesture I sought to undo the most terrible precedent set by a man that is pivotal with defending the liberties of our civilisation.

I do not think that burning a koran or bible (or any book) should be taken lightly or jokingly. However, as a symbol of the freedoms and liberty of individuals, we ought to protect their right to do it. I only hope that individuals who do engage in such activity do so for valid reasons and not merely out of hatred. Nonetheless, that is a question for those individuals.
Mon Nov 01, 2010 4:04 pm
Aught3ModeratorUser avatarPosts: 4290Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2009 3:36 amLocation: New Zealand Gender: Male

Post Re: Read books, don't burn them

While I don't think anyone should confuse a symbol for reality, the point is that the symbol is pretty foul. You can burn books if you want, but literate people will look down on you.
Wanderer, there is no path, the path is made by walking.
Mon Nov 01, 2010 7:31 pm
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lrkunUser avatarPosts: 3831Joined: Wed Jun 23, 2010 8:37 pmLocation: R. Gender: Tree

Post Re: Read books, don't burn them

Everyone spits, however, it's a rule among men not to spit in front of women.
Unsupport unthink.
Tue Nov 02, 2010 6:22 am
AndiferousUser avatarPosts: 2727Joined: Mon Jan 04, 2010 7:00 amLocation: Laputa Gender: Time Lord

Post Re: Read books, don't burn them

lrkun wrote:Everyone spits, however, it's a rule among men not to spit in front of women.


Indeed, blood and guts can be a turnoff...

CasewithScience wrote:Hello,

My name is Alex Stewart and I did, publicly, burn a koran and a bible in Australia....


You may be interested in reviewing and ressurecting this thread, where the topic was argued extensively: Burn a Koran Day. As a forum we generally don't take offense to bumping old threads, as I suspect we have expectation of timeless value in these things anyway. There are a few other less directly related threads, too. Feel free to call us to task.

Welcome, btw. ;)
"As there seemed no measure between what Watt could understand, and what he could not, so there seemed none between what he deemed certain, and what he deemed doubtful."
~ Samuel Beckett, Watt
Tue Nov 02, 2010 6:45 am
CasewithSciencePosts: 5Joined: Sun Jun 13, 2010 7:06 pm Gender: Pinecone

Post Re: Read books, don't burn them

"You can burn books if you want, but literate people will look down on you. "


So the ability to read and the burning of books are inconsistent? You should actually amend that statement to the following:

You can burn books if you want, but snooty people will look down on you.

You have a difference of opinion, that is fine. I just think that it is funny you are now trying to surreptitiously co-opt your views into those of people who are literate.

You have made a classic theistic move actually. (<----- hypocrisy intended ;)
Thu Nov 04, 2010 10:31 pm
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